Hi, this is Wayne again with a topic “We need to talk about Microsoft again…”.
We had a power outage last week and when we stitched together, the clips of the WAN show, our main topic was um cut by accident, worn out of it their conspiracy theories that Microsoft found out. We were going to talk about Windows, modern standby, and cut the power and deleted the VOD um. Actually it was just a miscommunication with the clips that had to be salvaged from one place and another place and put back together anyway. The point is we’re going to rehash that real, quick styles, for you guys is it Windows. Is it modern standby, it’s modern standby.
Let’S talk about it, yeah our little video about Windows, modern standby, really lit some fires internally over at Microsoft and Alex was able to have a chat with the VP of Windows, platform and services to go over some questions. Question number one why the heck is S3? Sleep, which you know, seemed to work, pretty good, being removed from the bioses of laptops, and the answer is: Microsoft is moving away from S3 sleep because how each device goes to sleep is controlled by that device’s firmware. That means for a device to sleep properly. The firmware needs to be maintained by the company that made said device, and I don’t know about you Luke, but sleep has worked perfectly on every computer I’ve ever owned. I I genuinely don’t believe I have ever actually had a computer or sleep consistently worked ever.
I don’t think I have you haven’t actually owned, that many computers. No that’s true, yeah, that’s valid true, your own two laptops. Ever no really. What do you run for a laptop now? I I got a pretty cool one. Actually did you steal it from work? I did you told me to to be fair.
You literally told me to on the guy. There is footage proof of this. You threw laptops at me. I did do that.
You did. What are you running now? What did you take? I didn’t do you. I did. I didn’t actually do you use it to cheat in the ark challenge. No, no! I genuinely didn’t okay. What is it uh? I actually don’t even remember it’s an Asus laptop, it’s a nice one.
I don’t remember the model I didn’t ask like. I just asked for a laptop that was it and – and I got handed like a very nice one, all right cool it does like when you turn it on. It goes like okay.
I know that much all right yeah. It does that by using S zero sleep instead of S3 sleep, Microsoft gets more control over sleep instead of the device manufacturer and has a much higher success rate for everything going to sleep and waking up properly using SEO. Sleep also apparently helps with security.
Since Windows is in control of the device at all times, okay, our next question is um. Well, you know that’s the problem, obviously still because it’s not working properly still, so what is being done as we anticipated figuring out what’s going wrong with Windows, modern standby is very difficult, since many of the bugs are what they called heisen Bugs AKA. If You observe the bugs their behavior actually changes, a lot of telemetry is turned off during sleep to reduce power consumption. Obviously, but this also means that if you turn on said Telemetry to try to diagnose a problem with sleep, well, the test you’re running is no longer the same. Because now you’ve got a bunch of telemetry running they’ve. Looked into the situation that we described where our laptop doesn’t properly go into disconnected sleep when you unplug it. While it is sleeping on some devices, it looks like we actually got it right. That does seem to be a problem and they’re looking into a fix, but they said it is only one of many potential ways that modern standby can cause problems. Basically, if we want this issue to go away, Microsoft soft needs a whack ton of data. Alright, then, I will say one thing before you before you go there. I will say the heisen bugs thing. Yes, I think most people when they hear that aren’t going to think like if you change something bad yeah, yeah totally yeah anyways doesn’t matter. Our chairs are at really different Heights today. Ah, that’s what happened yeah! That’S not real! Ah, okay, uh anyway. So what should you do when modern standby problems happen to someone within Linus Media Group? We’Ve been given a direct line to report these bugs um, which is great for us to help get them data, but, as you can probably imagine, um not everyone is going to be able to do that.
Well, okay, so first the process for us. When we find a laptop hot and dead, we can go into command, prompt as an admin and type in power C. This has got to be CFG.
That’S going to be a typo, a power. Config space, slash sleep study! This makes a ZIP file with all the battery data from our computer for the last while um. The notes Here say maybe do this on your laptop now to demonstrate. I did it last week the float plane version of the VOD, I think actually does have it. I think so I think so, so I’m not going to bother doing it again. The point is, it makes a little zip file.
We are then able to forward this log directly to Microsoft, so they can hopefully figure out. What’S going on. Unfortunately, not everyone gets a direct line to Microsoft, but by reporting bugs we can hopefully get them more data to figure things out, and these are the steps the feedback Hub is the best way to provide detailed feedback on issues to the windows. Engineering team. Do you want me to show it yeah yeah sure the tool gathers detailed logs and can run additional dig, not diagnostic sticks Diagnostics, to help them fix issues. Feedback Hub can be opened up in Windows, and you just need to give yourself a relevant title.
Like say, for example, that my computer battery is draining while it is asleep click report, a problem then provide more information on the specific issue. We’Ve got an example kind of filled out for you, but the more details you can provide the better. What was happening before? What was happening after click next choose power and battery and sleep. It might actually automatically select this based on what you provided in the description and make sure, though, that you get the right um the right drop down selected here. This way it will actually end up with the appropriate engineering team.
It will also help to gather relevant Telemetry from your system next new feedback and then on the add, more details. Section Mark has high severity if you’ve hit the battery drain issue. This is clearly a major Focus for them. Uh, then, for items below I’d pick inability to use my PC, I mean your battery’s dead, so like come on, let’s go in section four. This is the most critical part Gathering additional data.
Without this they will not have enough data to diagnose the issue. So for the battery drain issues select, sleep, click start recording, then wait 10 seconds or so and press stop. You don’t need to go through the actual sleep process. Nor do you need the screenshots. It may take a minute or two after stopping the recording by the way, you can also put your computer to sleep during the process, then reawaken it.
It will collect data across this process. Then click submit there’s also a forum post, which maybe Luke will open here. That will show you guys how to go over these steps. If you didn’t manage to catch everything that we just said just now, thank you very much Alex for creating that. So that’s that’s! It guys the only way for us to solve this problem is to work together, get Microsoft as much data as we can about the problem, because in their defense – and I think I often give Microsoft a pretty hard time – they’re a multi many billions of dollars. Company – and sometimes they have problems that I just that feel just utterly inexcusable, like any of their multiplayer gaming stuff, basically at all on PC, the default search within Windows start menu – oh my God yep. How that is so bad in this day and age uh. It just it boggles the mind. I give them a pretty hard time, but in their defense in defense of of of our corporate overlords, please don’t cut the power to the WAN show. It really is a huge challenge, supporting such a wide variety of different configurations and on the PC. It is functionally infinite right, like even on Android. You guys, I think, struggle a fair bit on the float plane app compared to iOS. Is that fair to say devices? Yeah, because there’s so many devices and you try to change something and it like okay, this, like API version, will cut off this many devices.
If you try to use it whatever blah blah like it’s, it can be pretty annoying. Um sleep is, as we mentioned earlier, a very tough problem to diagnose. Yes on Android, it’s a fraction of what you deal with on the Windows. Pc side of things within a single generation of devices got your Intel.
You’Ve got your AMD. You’Ve got all your different tiers of all the different skus from both of them. Oh, don’t forget, there’s desktop and mobile right and then oh well, I mean there’s not just one motherboard. No, no, no you’ve got dozens upon dozens of motherboard options for every one of those chips, all with slightly different firmware.
Oh and don’t forget that you might plug any number of rent what you plug, that tape drive in who plugs in a tape drive right. Like that’s the kind of thing they’re dealing with and all these different devices, many of which are engineered by very, very small teams. Surprisingly, small teams like like some some ran okay. I just became aware yesterday of a sound card.
Okay, a sound card from way back in the early 2000s that you need, if you want to build a DIY first gen, Xbox, dev kit and they’re in short supply, because I guess people build first gen Xbox Dev kits like for fun um, so so an enterprising Member of the community actually created a blueprint for this sound card that you can send to some like PCB yeah small room PCB manufacturer overseas and they’ll whip it up for you for about 50 bucks and send it back and okay. So let’s say you get a pcie to PCI adapter and you put one of those damn things in your system. Who knows how that goes to sleep, so it is legitimately a difficult problem for real. Hopefully, this helps and that’s all I have to say about that.
.